Bananas 8==D ~ ~ ~ ~ 0-:

hhn2002 said:
if you wanna know how i drift, ask him yourself. i havent been drifting lately bc my car is down. ohh how i'd love to drop a turbo in and get back out there.
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sounds like a serious driver to me....
 
The Redline 03 said:
I'm not going to say a smart ass comment but that's true to a certain degree. Yes, it can decelerate faster(i.e. better braking) but it also accelerates faster(depending on the power and weight in relation to the other car). It just comes off like your saying that the lighter car is at a disadvantage, but maybe I misunderstood what you meant. I don't feel like writing an essay but this subject always seems to cause an ego clash, it's like talking about politics or religion.

Oh what I meant by tossed more aggressively is a more violent turn in or feint to initiate the drift, it's just a typical thing that crazy Hibino does ;).

To get back on topic, great vid and I hope to see more posted :bigthumbu.
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no, no i didnt mean to come off sounding like a smartass. my bad. we can both agree that lighter cars have less inertia thus they can make changes much quicker, say change in direction or rotation. because of that they have to "work" harder to break grip but that just means every thing happens faster in a lighter car. in drifting thats most notable when they rotate, i think this is the main reason why will's mustang seems so slow, if he'd lighten up his car he could rotate faster. imo the only time the lighter car is at a disadvantage is when they're short-wheel base and in the long sweeping high speed drifts, they struggle to not straighten out.
 
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boxmod said:
althought I didn't make it to the apex because of my horizontal momentum from the angle, this sequence from Bladder shows my car going backwards for a short time and then pulling back out of it. I did it later and bogged out as I got into the turn. Both times I thought I was spinning out though and just got lucky...

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Yeah Moroso is a really good place to practice this. At FDC I wasn't quite coming in backwards, but I was carrying more angle than my steering angle would allow. Like come in fast, flick it hard, and then use hand brake/foot brake to get the car under control. I could feel the front tires just sliding along, and then just before getting to the turn, floor it and let the clutch out. Then the front tires would get traction again and the car would go around the turn. SO much fun. I was doing it pretty consistently through the end of practice and qualifying. I wish my car was running good at the demo so I could've done that some more.

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It just has to do with throwing the car slightly past the point of control at the top speed and then waiting until speed is slightly slower to where you have forward grip again and can ride out.
 
FlyinFINN said:
It just has to do with throwing the car slightly past the point of control at the top speed and then waiting until speed is slightly slower to where you have forward grip again and can ride out.
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Slightly past the point of control? I have never seen a car with anywhere near 90* of steering angle. Dood was wellll past 90 going backwards.
 
boxmod said:
my take on it...

i dont think its massive rear grip. its more the timing of the counter, how much angle his steering HAS, and how aggressively he is tossing it in. He also brakes in all of them i believe. he is basically throwing a 180 but throws it soft enough (while throwing it hard), with quick (early) countersteering. he catches it with the brake i think, and then dumps on the throttle. as the car stops its backward momentum while sliding to the side, it instantly starts going back forward and the car 'drives' out of the extreme angle.

think of being in your car, stopped, and turning wheel full over. now drop to clutch at like 4k and do a burnout. itll turn to the side. now instead of starting at a stop, you have to throw the car into a stop in the Y (forward/backward) momentum while keeping some X axis (sideways) momentum. The rest is all timing and throttle/steering to come out of it in the same direction or to transition.

its not impossible in theory but SHIT, its VERY insane to do.
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OH SWEET! Now that you told me how to do it, I'll try it on Forza since I still have no car for almost 2 years. If it doesn't work, prepare to be bombarded with hate PM's. lol.

On the real though, you make plenty of sense with this explanation, but I still think having plenty of grip in the rear is a necessity to pull off angle like that. ESPECIALLY at those speeds, which is probably near 120 mph. I know at Autopolis they are slapping 130 mph. Quite amazing.
 
Latino Hibino said:
On the real though, you make plenty of sense with this explanation, but I still think having plenty of grip in the rear is a necessity to pull off angle like that. ESPECIALLY at those speeds, which is probably near 120 mph. I know at Autopolis they are slapping 130 mph. Quite amazing.
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Yeah, abunch of rear grip is what made that possible.
Like idk if I can explain it.

Doods gettin it, mad sideways like that. gets it wayyyy out and just floors it and clutch kicks, wich with all that grip pushes the car forward making it steer again. Idfk.
I know when I drive school car on fresh tires, I can start clutch kickin when im spinning and it will pull me out and go around the corner. Shits gnarly.
 
yea it has to have grip, but massive grip makes a car too hard to reliably break it loose and then, are very twitchy. no doubt he has good grippy tires, but then again, EVERYONE in d1 does. that is not what sets him apart. it is a factor for sure, but the timing and balance is more important IMO.

if you had somewhat lower grip tires you could just do this from an earlier point because the forward spin of the tires would have less effect per 'second' and take longer to slow you and start your exit. on the other hand, it would be harder to 'catch the rear' before its around with too little grip.
 
Bearcat said:
Slightly past the point of control? I have never seen a car with anywhere near 90* of steering angle. Dood was wellll past 90 going backwards.
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It's hard to explain what I'm trying to say. Yes he's past 90, but he's going into a turn.
 
well the 90* is a reference to the direction of roadway, so you are saying the road's path "catches" up to him so his angle becomes more inline with the road.
 
boxmod said:
well the 90* is a reference to the direction of roadway, so you are saying the road's path "catches" up to him so his angle becomes more inline with the road.
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I'm saying, with the right timing and as he slows down and gains grip in the rear, he steps on it and rides out into the turn where he's heading.
 
i think it's by accident.

the front wheels aren't turned as much as the angle of the car against the road is, meaning his front tires are skidding. Its like a 4 wheel drift. U can see that in the vid on the second page of Koguchi with the big tire smoke all around.
 
The only reasons he made that happen was because of his speed and also being lucky or that he timed it right for the turn, it could have gone either way but he made it because of his speed, and once he saw a window opening at the turn he floored it as you can tell by the cloud of smoke he left at the turn.
 
Buriantsu said:
The only reasons he made that happen was because of his speed and also being lucky or that he timed it right for the turn, it could have gone either way but he made it because of his speed, and once he saw a window opening at the turn he floored it as you can tell by the cloud of smoke he left at the turn.
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Not entirely true. He didn't get lucky. He's done this before. Yes, the speed has to do with it, but there is more to it then just that. Steering angle, timing of brakes, gas and clutch all have to do with it, just as boxmod explained.
 
green_machine said:
i think it's by accident.

the front wheels aren't turned as much as the angle of the car against the road is, meaning his front tires are skidding. Its like a 4 wheel drift. U can see that in the vid on the second page of Koguchi with the big tire smoke all around.
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I've seen many rediculous entries before that require full lock and then some, so this is not an accident. The one with Koguchi, yes, because you can tell it wasn't supposed to be that way, but Kawabata on the other hand has it down packed. I've never seen a car with a 90* steering angle. Maybe 70* is as high as I've seen, possibly 2-3* more. So all these entries where the cars are entering with more angle than that must be by accident too, right? Nope. The drivers just have it down like that.

I remember Giacomo showing me something on how Ueo 4 wheel drifts, and this was back in 2002-2003. So these crazy angles have been around for a while, it's just now they are absolutely going crazy with it.
 
when he gets beyond the angle that his wheels can give that is when he is four wheel skidding. he was able to maintain that angle while four wheel skidding by keeping off the gas for the most part.
in a full on 90* skid one can control the angle by varying the rate of deceleration in the front or rear. because in a 90*skid the whole car is slowing down, both front and rear and it will remain at 90* until you change the rate of deceleration of either. same idea of locking up all your tires but sideways. if say you spin up the rear tires the rear will become more "slippery" and decelerate at a slower rate than the front which will bring the rear farther ahead. or if you turn the front wheel towards the direction your skidding then it will wont resist the sideways motion as much and it will go ahead of the rear tires.

whether or not he was lucky or it was an accident doesnt change the fact that its possible to learn to do.
 
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